|  |  | Previous Folio / Shabbath Contents / Tractate List / Navigate Site # Babylonian Talmud: Tractate Shabbath ### Folio 38a What1 if one forgot a pot on the stove and [thus] cooked it on the Sabbath? He was silent and said nothing to them [his questioners]. On the morrow he went out and lectured to them: If one cooks [food] on the Sabbath unwittingly, he may eat [it]; if deliberately, he may not eat [it];2 and there is no difference. What is meant by, 'and there is no difference'? — Rabbah and R. Joseph both explain it permissively: only he who cooked it, thus performing an action, may not eat if it was deliberate; but this one3 who did no action may eat even if it was deliberate. R. Nahman b. Isaac explained it restrictively: only one who cooks may eat if it was done unwittingly, because he will not [thereby] come to dissemble;4 but this one, who may come to dissemble,5 may not even eat if it was unwitting. An objection is raised: if one forgot a pot on the stove and [thus] cooked it on the Sabbath: unwittingly, he may eat [thereof]; if deliberately, he may not eat. When is that said? In the case of hot water insufficiently heated or a dish insufficiently cooked; but as for hot water sufficiently heated or a dish sufficiently cooked, whether unwitting or deliberate, he may eat [thereof]: thus said R. Meir. R. Judah said: Hot water sufficiently heated is permitted, because it boils away6 and is thus harmed;7 a dish sufficiently cooked is forbidden, because it shrinks and is thereby improved, and whatever shrinks and is thereby improved, e.g., cabbage, beans, and mincemeat, is forbidden; but whatever shrinks and thereby deteriorates, is permitted. At all events, a dish insufficiently cooked is mentioned.8 As for R. Nahman b. Isaac, it is well, there is no difficulty: here9 it is before [the enactment of] the preventive measure;10 there11 it is after the preventive measure.12 But [on the view of] Rabbah and R. Joseph who explain it permissively, if before the preventive measure,13 'deliberate' is a difficulty;14 if after the preventive measure, even unwitting' too is a difficulty.15 That is [indeed] a difficulty. What was the preventive measure? — For R. Judah b. Samuel said in the name of R. Abba in the name of R. Kahana in Rab's name: At first it was ruled: One who cooks [food] on the Sabbath unwittingly, he may eat [thereof], if deliberately, he may not eat; and the same applies to one who forgets.16 But when those who intentionally left [it there] grew numerous, and they pleaded, We had forgotten [it on the stove], they [the Sages] retraced their steps and penalized him who forgot. Now, R. Meir is self-contradictory, and R. Judah is [likewise] self-contradictory?17 — R. Meir is not self-contradictory: the one means at the outset; the other, if done.18 R. Judah too is not self-contradictory: there it means that it [the stove] was swept or covered with ashes;19 here, that it was not swept or covered with ashes. The scholars propounded: What if one transgressed and deliberately left it? Did the Rabbis penalize him or not? — Come and hear: For Samuel b. Nathan said in R. Hanina's name: When R. Jose went to Sepphoris, he found hot water which had been left on the stove, and did not forbid it to them; [he also found] shrunken eggs,20 and forbade them to them. Surely it means for that Sabbath?21 — No: for the following Sabbath.22 Now, this implies that shrunken eggs go on shrinking and are thereby improved? — Yes. For R. Hama b. Hanina said: My Master and I were once guests in a certain place, and eggs shrunk to the size of crab-apples were brought before us, and we ate many of them. BETH HILLEL RULE: ONE MAY REPLACE [IT] TOO. R. Shesheth said: On the view of him who maintains To Part b Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files On the view that it is forbidden to keep food on an unswept stove. This is a Mishnah. 'And there is no difference' is R. Hiyya b. Abba's addition in answer to the question. Sc. who left the pot on the stove. 'If one cooks' means by placing it on the stove. I.e., cook deliberately and pretend that it was unwitting. Since cooking is Biblically forbidden, one is not suspected of evading the prohibition. If it may be eaten when it is inadvertently left on the stove and cooked, he may leave it there deliberately and pretend forgetfulness, for the prohibition of leaving a pot on the stove is only Rabbinical. Lit., 'shrinks'. By the loss. Hence there is no fear of raking up the coals to make it boil more.-'Sufficiently heated' means to boiling point. And a distinction is drawn between inadvertence and a deliberate act. This contradicts both views supra. In the Baraitha quoted. Stated infra. R. Nahman's interpretation of R. Hiyya b. Abba's ruling. The prohibition stated by R. Nahman is only a preventive measure of the Rabbis, and the Baraitha states the law prior thereto. I.e., if R. Hiyya b. Abba's ruling was stated before the preventive measure was enacted. The Baraitha states that it is forbidden, whilst he ruled that it is permitted. Because the Baraitha which states that it is permitted in that case was taught before the preventive measure. A dish on the stove, and it is cooked. V. supra 37a. There R. Meir forbids a dish, even if sufficiently cooked, whilst here he permits it. On the other hand, R. Judah permits there a dish if sufficiently cooked, whilst here he forbids it. — The views they both give there of Beth Hillel's ruling must be regarded as their own too, since the halachah is always as Beth Hillel. On 37a the question is what may be done at the outset; there R. Meir rules that one must not leave a dish on the stove, even if it was sufficiently cooked before the Sabbath. But here he rules that if it was so left it is permitted. Then the dish is permitted. Eggs boiled or roasted down to a small size. He forbade them to eat the eggs on that Sabbath. This answers the question. He told them not to leave the eggs on the stove for the future. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference ### Shabbath 38b that one may replace it, [it is permitted] even on the Sabbath.1 And R. Oshaia too holds that ONE MAY REPLACE IT TOO means even on the Sabbath. For R. Oshaia said: We were once standing before R. Hiyya Rabbah, and we brought up a kettle of hot water for him from the lower to the upper storey, mixed the cup for him,2 and then replaced it, and he said not a word to us. R. Zerika said in the name of R. Abba in R. Taddai's name: We learnt this only if they3 are still in his hand: but if he set them down on the ground, it is forbidden.4 R. Ammi observed: R. Taddai who acted [thus] acted for himself [only].5 But thus did R. Hiyya say in R. Johanan's name: Even if he set them down on the ground, it is permitted. R. Dimi and R. Samuel b. Judah differ therein, and both [state their views] in R. Eleazar's name: One says: If they are still in his hand, it is permitted; on the ground, it is forbidden. While the other maintains: Even If he placed them on the ground, it is still permitted. Hezekiah6 observed in Abaye's name: As to what you say that if it is still in his hand it is permitted, — that was said only where it was his [original] intention to replace them; but if it was not his intention to replace them, it is forbidden. Hence it follows that [if they are] on the ground, even if it was his intention to replace them, it is forbidden. Others state: Hezekiah observed in Abaye's name: As to what you say that if they are on the ground it is forbidden, that was said only if it was not his [original] intention to replace them; but if it was his intention to replace them, it is permitted. Hence it follows that [if they are] in his hand, even if it was not his intention to replace them, it is permitted. R. Jeremiah propounded: What if he hung them on a staff or placed them on a couch?7 R. Ashi propounded: What if he emptied them from one kettle to another? The questions stand over. MISHNAH. IF AN OVEN WAS HEATED WITH STUBBLE OR RAKINGS, ONE MUST NOT PLACE [A POT, ETC.,] EITHER INSIDE OR ON TOP.8 IF A KUPPAH9 WAS HEATED WITH STUBBLE OR RAKINGS, IT IS LIKE A DOUBLE STOVE;10 WITH PEAT OR TIMBER, IT IS LIKE AN OVEN, GEMARA. IF AN OVEN WAS HEATED: R. Joseph thought to explain INSIDE AND ON TOP literally, but as for leaning [a pot against it], that is well. Abaye objected to him: IF A KUPPAH WAS HEATED WITH STUBBLE OR RAKINGS, IT IS LIKE A DOUBLE STOVE; WITH PEAT OR TIMBER, IT IS LIKE AN OVEN, and is forbidden. Hence if it were like a [double] stove, it would be permitted. To what is the reference: Shall we say, on its top? Then under what circumstance? Shall we say that it is not swept or covered with ashes? Is the top of a stove permitted when it is not swept or covered with ashes? Hence it must surely mean to lean against it; yet it is taught, IT IS LIKE AN OVEN, and forbidden? — Said R. Adda b. Ahabah: Here the reference is to a kuppah that is swept or covered with ashes, and an oven that is swept or covered with ashes: IT IS LIKE AN OVEN, in that though it is swept or covered with ashes, the top is forbidden; for if it were like a [double] stove, if swept or covered with ashes, it would be well.11 It was taught in accordance with Abaye: If an oven is heated with stubble or rakings, one may not lean [a pot, etc.,] against it, and [placing on] the top goes without saying,12 and in the inside goes without saying; and it goes without saying [when it is heated] with peat or wood. If a kuppah is heated with stubble or rakings, one may lean [a pot] against it, but not place [it] on top;13 [but if it is heated] with peat or wood, one must not lean [a pot] against it. R. Aha son of Raba asked R. Ashi: How is this kuppah regarded? If like a [double] stove, even with peat or wood too?14 If like an oven, neither with stubble or rakings?15 He answered: Its heat is greater than a [double] stove's but less than an oven's.16 What is a kuppah and what is a [double] stove [kirah]? — Said R. Jose b. Hanina: A kuppah has room for placing one pot; a [double] stove [kirah] has room for placing two pots. Abaye — others state, R. Jeremiah — said: We learnt likewise: If a [double] stove [kirah] is divided along its length, it is clean; along its breadth, it is unclean; [if] a kuppah [is divided], whether along its length or along its breadth, it is clean.17 MISHNAH. ONE MUST NOT PLACE AN EGG AT THE SIDE OF A BOILER FOR IT TO BE ROASTED,18 AND ONE MUST NOT BREAK IT INTO A [HOT] CLOTH;19 BUT R. JOSE PERMITS IT. AND ONE MAY NOT PUT IT AWAY IN [HOT] SAND OR ROAD DUST FOR IT TO BE ROASTED. IT ONCE HAPPENED THAT THE PEOPLE OF TIBERIAS DID THUS: THEY CONDUCTED A PIPE OF COLD WATER THROUGH AN ARM OF THE HOT SPRINGS.20 SAID THE SAGES TO THEM: IF ON THE SABBATH,21 IT IS LIKE HOT WATER HEATED ON THE SABBATH, AND IS FORBIDDEN BOTH FOR WASHING AND FOR DRINKING; IF ON A FESTIVAL, IT IS LIKE WATER HEATED ON A FESTIVAL, WHICH IS FORBIDDEN FOR WASHING BUT PERMITTED FOR DRINKING. GEMARA. The scholars propounded: What if one does roast22 it? — Said R. Joseph: If one roasts it, he is liable to a sin-offering. Mar son of Rabina said, We learnt likewise: - To Next Folio - Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files Rashi: not only Friday evening, but on the morrow too. Wine was not drunk neat but diluted. The pot or hot water. To replace them on the stove. Being stricter than necessary. Var. lec.: Rab Hezekiah. That is intermediate between retaining them in his hand and placing them on the ground. The oven (tannur) had a broad base and narrowed at the top. It thereby retained more heat than a stove (kirah); hence the prohibition even if it is beated with stubble or rakings only. Jast.: a small stove or brazier. I.e., the ordinary stove which held two pots; v. 38b. I.e., permitted. That it is forbidden. Wilna Gaon emends: and may place (it) on top. It should be permitted, if it is swept or covered with ashes. Should it be permitted. Hence it occupies an intermediate position. When the kirah is divided along its length it cannot be used at all, hence it ceases to be a utensil and is clean (cf p. 163, n. 9); but when divided along its breadth, each portion can be used for one pot, and it is therefore subject to uncleanness. Since a kuppah has room for only one pot, whichever way it is divided it ceases to be a utensil and is clean. Lit., 'that it should be rolled'. To be roasted thus (Rashi). Others: he must not cause it to crack by wrapping it in a hot cloth and rolling it; v. Tosaf. Yom. Tob. a.l. Tiberias possesses thermal springs. This was done before the Sabbath. I.e., the water which is drawn from the pipe on the Sabbath. Lit., 'roll'. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference |  |  |