|  |  | Previous Folio / Nedarim Directory / Tractate List / Navigate Site # Babylonian Talmud: Tractate Nedarim ### Folio 63a An objection is raised: What is the time of the rainfall?1 The earliest is on the third [of Marheshwan],2 the middle [i.e., the second] on the seventh, and the last on the twenty-third: this is R. Meir's view. R. Judah said: The seventh, the seventeenth, and the twenty-third. R. Jose said: The seventeenth, the twenty-third, and the new moon of Kislew.3 And R. Jose used likewise to rule that individuals must not fast [for rain] until Kislew has commenced.4 Now we observed thereon: As for the first rainfall, it is well: [they differ] in respect of petitioning;5 the third [likewise] is in respect of fasting.6 But [as for] the second, in respect of what [is the controversy]? And R. Zera answered: In respect of one who vows.7 Whereon we observed: With whom does the following Baraitha agree: R. Simeon b. Gamaliel said: If the rain descends for seven days in succession, it is counted as the first and second rainfall?8 With whom does this agree? With R. Jose!9 — That refers to one who vows, 'Until the rains.' MISHNAH. [IF HE VOWS,] 'KONAM THAT I TASTE NOT WINE FOR A YEAR', IF THE YEAR IS INTERCALATED.10 HE IS FORBIDDEN DURING THE YEAR AND ITS EXTENSION. [IF HE SAYS.] 'UNTIL THE BEGINNING OF ADAR,'11 [IT MEANS] UNTIL THE BEGINNING OF THE FIRST ADAR; 'UNTIL THE END OF ADAR,' UNTIL THE END OF THE FIRST ADAR.12 GEMARA. Thus we see that by stating Adar, without qualification, the first is meant. Shall we say that our Mishnah reflects R. Judah's views? For it was taught: For the first Adar, one writes 'The first Adar'; for the second, simply 'Adar': this is R. Meir's view. R. Judah said: For the first Adar, one writes 'Adar'; for the second, one writes 'the second Adar'!13 — Abaye said: You may say that it agrees even with R. Meir: the latter is where he knew that it was a leap year; the former [i.e., the Mishnah], if he did not know.14 To Part b Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files Sc. the winter rain, which generally came in three periods, as explained here. There was also, of course, the Spring rain. V. Ta'an. 6a. Marheshwan is the eighth month of the year, corresponding to October-November. Kislew is the ninth month of the year, corresponding to November-December. And rain has not yet fallen. For rain. A short prayer for rain — [H] '(give) dew and rain', called she'elah, request or petition, is inserted in the eighth benediction of the 'amidah when the first rainfall is due. V. Ta'an. 10a. A public fast was proclaimed if the drought continued after the time of the third rainfall had arrived. V. Ta'an. I, 4-7: II, 1. I.e., if one vows, 'until the rains', it means until the second rainfall: hence the controversy as to when it is due. As we have seen, R. Simeon b. Gamaliel's own view is that the line of the rainfall is the deciding factor, whether it actually rains or not. But since the Rabbis maintain that the vow means until it rains, R. Simeon argued that even on their view, if it rains for seven days in succession, it should be considered as two rainfalls, and hence terminates the vow. It is now assumed that no dictinction is here made how he expressed his vow. But on R. Zera's view, that they all agree that where he says 'until the rain', the time of the first rainfall is the deciding factor, R. Simeon b. Gamaliel's remark is irrelevant. For in R. Meir's view there are only four days between the two rain-falls, and in R. Judah's there are ten. The Jewish year being lunar, an extra month is periodically intercalated to make it agree with the Solar year; v. J.E. art. 'Calendar'. The twelfth month of the year = February-March. Var. lec.: SECOND ADAR. When a year is intercalated, a month is added after Adar, which is called the second Adar. This is in reference to the dating of documents. If he knew and stated Adar, without qualification, the second is meant, in R. Meir's view. But if he did not know, he must have meant the first, since he does not wish to be in doubt as to the length of his vow, that he should include the second Adar if the year is subsequently intercalated. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference ### Nedarim 63b And it was taught even so: [If one writes.] 'until the new moon of Adar,' [it means] until the new moon of the first Adar; but if it was a leap year, until the new moon of the second Adar. Now, this proves that the first clause does not refer to leap year?1 Hence the latter clause means, if he knew that it was a leap year; the former, if he did not know. MISHNAH. R. JUDAH SAID: [IF ONE VOWS, — 'KONAM THAT I TASTE NO WINE UNTIL PASSOVER SHALL BE,' HE IS FORBIDDEN ONLY UNTIL THE PASSOVER NIGHT,2 FOR HE MERELY MEANT, UNTIL THE EVENING OF PASSOVER, UNTIL THE HOUR WHEN MEN ARE WONT TO DRINK WINE.3 IF HE VOWS, 'KONAM THAT I TASTE NO MEAT UNTIL THE FAST [I.E., THE DAY OF ATONEMENT] SHALL BE,' HE IS FORBIDDEN ONLY UNTIL THE EVE OF THE FAST, FOR HE MERELY MEANT, UNTIL PEOPLE USUALLY EAT MEAT.4 R. JOSE, HIS SON, SAID: [IF HE VOWS,] KONAM, IF I TASTE GARLIC UNTIL THE SABBATH, HE IS FORBIDDEN ONLY UNTIL SABBATH EVE [I.E., FRIDAY NIGHT], FOR HE MEANT, UNTIL IT IS CUSTOMARY FOR PEOPLE TO EAT GARLIC.5 IF HE SAYS TO HIS NEIGHBOUR 'KONAM, IF I BENEFIT FROM YOU, IF YOU DO NOT COME AND ACCEPT FOR YOUR SONS A KOR OF WHEAT AND TWO BARRELS OF WINE, THE LATTER MAY ANNUL HIS VOW WITHOUT RECOURSE TO A SAGE, BY DECLARING, 'DID YOU VOW FOR ANY OTHER PURPOSE BUT TO HONOUR ME? THIS [NON-ACCEPTANCES] IS MY HONOUR. LIKEWISE, IF HE SAYS TO HIS NEIGHBOUR, 'KONAM, IF YOU BENEFIT FORM ME, IF YOU DO NOT GIVE MY SON A KOR OF WHEAT AND TWO BARRELS OF WINE' — R. MEIR RULES: HE IS FORBIDDEN UNTIL HE GIVES; BUT THE SAGES MAINTAIN: HE TOO CAN ANNUL HIS VOW WITHOUT A SAGE, BY DECLARING, I REGARD IT AS THOUGH I HAVE RECEIVED IT. IF HE WAS URGING HIS NEIGHBOUR TO MARRY HIS SISTER'S DAUGHTER, AND HE EXCLAIMED, 'KONAM, IF SHE EVER BENEFITS FROM ME'; LIKEWISE, IF HE IS DIVORCING HIS WIFE AND VOWS, 'KONAM, IF MY WIFE HAS EVER BENEFIT FROM ME, — THEY ARE PERMITTED TO BENEFIT FROM HIM, BECAUSE HE MEANT ONLY MARRIAGE. IF HE WAS URGING HIS NEIGHBOUR TO EAT IN HIS HOUSE, AND HE REPLIED, 'KONAM, IF I ENTER, OR, 'THE DROP OF WATER THAT I DRINK, HE MAY ENTER HIS HOUSE AND DRINK COLD WATER BECAUSE HE ONLY MEANT EATING AND DRINKING IN GENERAL.6 - To Next Folio - Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files That is obviously impossible, since in that case 'until the new moon of the first Adar' is meaningless. So in Mishnayoth edd. This is the reading as amended by BaH. It was a widespread custom to eat meat on the eve of Atonement day. The point of these two rulings, as of the next too, is that although the expression might mean until Passover shall have been, etc., the imperfect being intended as a fut. perfect, yet since it is customary to drink wine in the first evening, he is assumed to have meant until it comes, which is also a possible rendering of his words. And the same applies to the vow regarding meat. I.e., on the eve if Sabbath; the institution thereof is ascribed to Ezra; v. B.K. 82a and supra 31a. But did not mean the expression to be taken literally. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference |  |  |