|  |  | Previous Folio / Shabbath Contents / Tractate List / Navigate Site # Babylonian Talmud: Tractate Shabbath ### Folio 100a that is not its [natural] rest. Raba propounded: If a nut [lies] in a vessel, and the vessel floats on water, what [is the law]? Do we regard the nut, and behold it is at rest; or do we regard the vessel, and behold it is not at rest? The question stands over. [In respect to] oil [floating] upon wine, R. Johanan b. Nuri and the Rabbis differ. For we learnt: If oil is floating upon wine, and a tebul yom touches the oil, he disqualifies the oil only. R. Johanan b. Nuri said: Both are attached to each other.1 Abaye said: If a pit in the street [is] ten deep and eight broad, and2 one throws a mat into it, he is culpable; but if he divides it with the mat,3 he is not culpable.4 Now according to Abaye. who is certain that the mat annuls the partition,5 a segment certainly annuls the partition;6 but according to R. Johanan to whom a segment is a problem, a mat certainly does not annul the partition.7 Abaye also said: If a pit in the street, ten deep and four broad, [is] full of water and one throws [an object] therein, he is culpable; [but if it is] full of produce and one throws [an object] therein, he is not culpable. What is the reason? Water does not annul the partition,8 [whereas] produce does annul the partition. It was taught likewise: If one throws [an object] from the sea into a street, or from a street into the sea, he is not liable,9 R. Simeon said: If there is in the place where he throws [it a separate cavity] ten deep and four broad, he is liable.10 MISHNAH. IF ONE THROWS [AN ARTICLE] FOUR CUBITS ON TO A WALL ABOVE TEN HANDBREADTHS, IT IS AS THOUGH HE THROWS IT INTO THE AIR; IF BELOW, IT IS AS THOUGH IT THROWS IT ON TO THE GROUND, AND HE WHO THROWS [AN ARTICLE] FOUR CUBITS ALONG THE GROUND11 IS CULPABLE. GEMARA. But it does not stay there? — Said R. Johanan: We learnt of a juicy cake of figs.12 Rab Judah said in Rab's name in the name of R. Hiyya: If one throws [an article] above ten [handbreadths] and it goes and alights in a cavity of any size, we come to a controversy of R. Meir and the Rabbis. According to R. Meir. who holds: We [imaginarily] hollow out to complete it, he is liable; according to the Rabbis who 'maintain, We do not hollow out to complete it, he is not liable.13 It was taught likewise: If one throws [an article] above ten and it goes and alights in a cavity of any size, R. Meir declares [him] culpable. whereas the Rabbis exempt [him]. Rab Judah said in Rab's name: If a [sloping] mound attains [a height of] ten [handbreadths] within [a distance of] four,14 and one throws [an object] and it alights on top of it, he is culpable. It was taught likewise: If an alley15 is level with within but becomes a slope towards the [main] street,16 or is level with the [main] street, but becomes a slope within,17 that alley requires neither a lath nor a beam.18 R. Hanina b. Gamaliel said: If a [sloping] mound attains [a height of] ten [handbreadths] within [a distance of] four, and one throws [an object] and it alights on top of it, he is culpable. MISHNAH. IF ONE THROWS[ [AN OBJECT] WITHIN FOUR CUBITS BUT IT ROLLS BEYOND FOUR CUBITS, HE IS NOT CULPABLE; BEYOND FOUR CUBITS BUT IT ROLLS WITHIN FOUR CUBITS, HE IS CULPABLE.19 GEMARA. But it did not rest [beyond four cubits]?20 — Said R. Johanan: Providing it rests [beyond four cubits] on something, whatever its size.21 It was taught likewise: If one throws [an article] beyond four cubits, but the wind drives it within, even if it carries it out again, he is not liable; if the wind holds it for a moment,22 even if it carries it in again, he is liable. Raba said: [An article brought] within three [handbreadths] must, according to the Rabbis, rest upon something, however small.23 Meremar sat and reported this statement. Said Rabina to Meremar: To Part b Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files V. supra 5b for notes on the whole passage. I.e., eight by four-the pit of course is private ground. E.g., a stiff cane mat, which stands up vertically across the middle of the pit, The thickness of the mat leaves less than four square handbreadths on either side, so that neither is now private ground. As in the previous note. V. question asked by R. Johanan, supra 99b. For the mat does not become part of the pit; v. p. 477. n. 3. Hence the pit is private ground in spite of the water, The sea is a karmelith, supra 6a. Since it stands apart from the rest of the sea. This cavity too is naturally filled with water; hence we see that water does not annul the partition. Or, over the ground, within the height of ten handbreadths. V. supra 7b for notes on this and the Mishnah. v. supra 7b for notes. This renders it too steep to be negotiated in one's ordinary stride, and the top is therefore counted as private ground. This ranks as a karmelith, supra 6a. Into which it debouches. The ground on the inner side of the entrance is of the same level as the main street for a short distance, but then falls away. To convert it into private ground (v. supra 9a), the slope itself being an effective partition. In both cases it did not properly rest before the wind drove it back or forward. Why is he culpable in the latter case? Even not on the ground itself, and stays there momentarily. Rashi: The same holds good if the wind keeps it stationary for a moment within three handbreadths of the ground 'in the principle of labud (v. Glos.). [Wilna Gaon reads: Provided it rests for a little while.] Beyond the four cubits. The reference is to the Rabbis' view that an object caught up in the air is not regarded as at rest, in contrast to R. Akiba's ruling that it is as at rest (supra 97a). Raba states that the Rabbis hold thus even if the object comes within three handbreadths of the ground: it must actually alight upon something, otherwise it is not regarded as having been deposited. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference ### Shabbath 100b Is this not [to be deduced from] our Mishnah, whereon R. Johanan commented. Providing it rests on something, whatever its size?1 You speak of [a] rolling [object]. replied he; [a] rolling [object] is not destined to rest; but this, since it is destined to rest,2 [I might argue that] though it did not come to rest, it is as though it had rested:3 therefore he informs us [that it is not so]. MISHNAH. IF ONE THROWS [AN OBJECT OVER A DISTANCE OF] FOUR CUBITS IN THE SEA, HE IS NOT LIABLE. IF THERE IS A WATER POOL. AND A PUBLIC ROAD TRAVERSES IT, AND ONE THROWS [AN OBJECT] FOUR CUBITS THEREIN. HE IS LIABLE. AND WHAT DEPTH CONSTITUTES A POOL? LESS THAN TEN HANDBREADTH.3 IF THERE IS A POOL OF WATER AND A PUBLIC ROAD TRAVERSES IT, AND ONE THROWS [AN OBJECT] FOUR CUBITS THEREIN,4 HE IS LIABLE. GEMARA. One of the Rabbis said to Raba, As for 'traversing [mentioned] twice, that is well, [as] it informs us this: [i] traversing with difficulty is designated traversing;5 [ii] use with difficulty is not designated use.6 But why [state] POOL twice? — One refers to summer, and the other to winter, and both are necessary. For if only one were stated, I would say: That is only in summer, when it is the practice of people to walk therein to cool themselves; but in winter [it is] not [so]. And if we were informed [this] of winter, [I would say that] because they are mudstained they do not object;7 but in summer [it is] not [so]. Abaye said, They are necessary: I might argue, That is only where it [the pool] is not four cubits [across]; but where it is four cubits [across], one goes round it.8 R. Ashi said; They are necessary: I might argue, That is only where it [the pool] is four [across];9 but where it is not four, one steps over it.10 Now, R. Ashi is consistent with his opinion. For R. Ashi said: If one throws [an object] and it alights on the junction of a landing bridge.11 he is culpable, since many pass across it.12 MISHNAH. IF ONE THROWS [AN OBJECT] FROM THE SEA TO DRY LAND,13 OR FROM DRY LAND TO THE SEA, FROM THE SEA TO A SHIP14 OR FROM A SHIP TO THE SEA OR FROM ONE SHIP TO ANOTHER, HE IS NOT CULPABLE. IF SHIPS ARE TIED TOGETHER, ONE MAY CARRY FROM ONE TO ANOTHER. IF THEY ARE NOT TIED TOGETHER, THOUGH LYING CLOSE [TO EACH OTHER], ONE MAY NOT CARRY FROM ONE TO ANOTHER. GEMARA. It was stated: As for a ship. R. Huna said, A projection, whatever its size, is stuck out [over the side of the ship]. and [water] may then be drawn [from the sea]; R. Hisda and Rabbah son of R. Huna both maintain: One rigs up an enclosure15 four [handbreadths square] and draws [water].16 [Now], R. Huna said: A projection, whatever its size, is stuck out, and [water] may then be drawn; he holds that the karmelith is measured from the [sea-]bed. so that the air space is a place of non-liability'.17 Hence logically not even a projection is required.18 but [it is placed there] to serve as a distinguishing mark.19 R. Hisda and Rabbah son of R. Huna both maintain: One rigs up an enclosure four square and draws [water]': they hold that the karmelith is measured from the surface of the water, the water being [as] solid ground.20 [Hence] if a place of four [square] is not set up. one transports [the water] from a karmelith to private ground.21 R. Nahman said to Rabbah b. Abbuha: But according to R. Huna, who said, 'A projection, whatever its size, is stuck out and [water] may then be drawn', — but sometimes these are not ten,22 and so one carries from a karmelith to private ground? — Said he to him: It is well known that a ship cannot travel in less than ten [handbreadths of water].23 But it has a projecting point?24 — Said R. Safra: Sounders precede it.25 R. Nahman b. Isaac said to R. Hiyya b. Abin: But according to R. Hisda and Rabbah son of R. Huna, who maintain, 'One rigs up an enclosure four [square] and draws [water]'. — how could he throw out his waste water?26 And should you answer that he throws it [likewise] through that same enclosure, — it is [surely] repulsive to him!27 — He throws it against the sides of the ship.28 But there is his force [behind it]?29 They [the Sages] did not prohibit one's force in connection with a karmelith. And whence do you say this? Because it was taught: As for a ship. one may not carry [e.g.. water] from it into the sea or from the sea into it. - To Next Folio - Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files Since he does not explain that the object came within three, it follows that even then it must alight on something. It is actually falling when intercepted within three handbreadths from the ground. Hence the thrower is culpable. I.e., it travels four cubits before it rests. That is also the meaning in the previous case. Hence the public road that passes through a pool counts as public ground, though one can only traverse it with difficulty. E.g., a pit in the street nine handbreadths deep. Though one can put objects therein, it is inconvenient, and therefore is not the same as a pillar of that height in the street upon which people temporarily place their burdens whilst pausing to rest, and which ranks as public ground (supra 8a). The deduction that such use is not designated use follows from the repetition of traversing, which intimates that only traversing with difficulty is regarded as such, but nothing else. To wade through a pool. Instead of wading through it; hence it is not public ground. Therefore it is stated twice, to show that this case too is included. Rashi adds cubits; but the masc. form [H] must refer to handbreadths. This reading is also more likely, as otherwise he would not say that if less than four one might step across it. — S. Strashun. And thus avoids it. Perhaps where the bridge joins the quay. Though many, on the other hand, step over it, it does not on that account cease to be ground publicly used, and the same applies above. Which is from a karmelith to public ground. I.e., from a karmelith to private ground. Lit., 'place'. I.e., an enclosure above the water is made, which renders the water immediately below technically private ground. and through this the water is drawn. Only ten handbreadths above the ground rank as a karmelith, whilst the space above that is a place of non-liability (supra 7a). Hence everything above the surface of the sea, and even the sea itself above ten handbreadths from its bed, fall within the latter category. For one may certainly carry from a place of non-liability. That one may not carry from a real karmelith. The sea-bed and the sea count as one, as though the ground of the karmelith rose very high. Viz., the ship. Handbreadths from the sea-bed to its surface, so that the whole of the sea is a karmelith. By sefina a large ship is meant, not a small boat. Rashi: the ship has a projecting point (sc. a helm), and as that rises out of the water it is possible for it to sail into a draught of even less than ten handbreadths, and should water be drawn at this point one transports from a karmelith to private ground. Tosaf. and R. Han. (on the reading preserved in MS.M.): perhaps it (the sea-bed) has a projecting eminence just where the water is drawn, from the top of which there are less than ten handbreadths to the sea surface? Men who sound the depth of the water with long poles, and they take care to avoid such shallows. For it is forbidden to throw from a private ground (the ship) to a karmelith (the sea). To draw water subsequently through the same place. Whence it descends into the sea. Even if he does not throw it directly into the sea, he does so indirectly through the exercise of his force. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference |  |  |