|  |  | Previous Folio / Niddah Directory / Tractate List / Navigate Site # Babylonian Talmud: Tractate Niddah ### Folio 47a is subject to the obligation of the dough-offering1 and2 does not become unfit through contact with a tebul yom;3 so R. Meir and R. Judah, but R. Jose and R. Simeon exempt it from the obligation of the dough-offering. Assuming4 that he who holds that the institution of terumah 5 is Pentateuchal also holds that of the dough-offering5 to be Pentateuchal and that he who holds that terumah 5 is Rabbinical also holds the dough-offering5 to be Rabbinical, the ruling would be well justified if you grant that R. Jose6 is of the opinion that the dough offering at the present time is only Rabbinical, since the Rabbinic law which subjects the dough to the restrictions of terumah may well override the Rabbinical law of the dough-offering, but if you maintain that the institution of the dough-offering7 is Pentateuchal,8 could the Rabbinic law which subjects the dough to the restrictions of terumah override the institution of the dough offering which is Pentateuchal?9 — But is it not possible that R. Jose holds that terumah at the present time is a Pentateuchal institution while the dough offering is only a Rabbinical one, as in fact R. Huna son of R. Joshua stated in a reply?10 For R. Huna son of R. Joshua stated, I found the Rabbis of the college sitting at their studies and saying, 'Even according to him who holds that terumah at the present time is a Rabbinical institution, the dough offering is a Pentateuchal one, for during the seven years in which they11 conquered Canaan and during the seven years in which they divided it12 they were under the obligation of the dough offering though they were under no obligation to give tithe'; and I told them, 'Even according to him who holds that terumah at the present time is Pentateuchal, the dough offering is only Rabbinical, for it was taught: If Scripture had written, "when you come"13 it might have been presumed [that the obligation of the dough-offering should come into force] as soon as two or three spies had entered, hence it is said, In your coming,14 I have spoken15 only of the coming of all of you and not of the coming of a portion of you; but when Ezra brought them up not all of them went up with him.'16 MISHNAH. THE SAGES SPOKE OF [THE PHYSICAL DEVELOPMENT OF] A WOMAN IN FIGURATIVE SPEECH: AN UNRIPE FIG, A FIG IN ITS EARLY RIPENING STAGE AND A RIPE FIG. SHE IS LIKE AN UNRIPE FIG' WHILE SHE IS YET A CHILD; A FIG IN ITS EARLY RIPENING STAGE' WHEN SHE IS IN THE AGE OF17 HER MAIDENHOOD. DURING BOTH THE LATTER AND THE FORMER AGES,18 THEY19 RULED, HER FATHER IS ENTITLED TO ANYTHING SHE FINDS AND TO HER HANDIWORK AND TO THE RIGHT OF INVALIDATING HER VOWS. 'A RIPE FIG' — AS SOON AS SHE BECOMES A BOGERETH, AND HER FATHER HAS NO LONGER ANY RIGHT OVER HER. WHAT ARE THE MARKS [OF A BOGERETH]? R. JOSE THE GALILEAN SAYS: THE APPEARANCE OF20 THE WRINKLE BENEATH THE BREAST. R. AKIBA SAYS: THE HANGING DOWN OF21 THE BREASTS. BEN AZZAI SAYS: THE DARKENING OF THE RING AROUND THE NIPPLE. R. JOSE SAYS: [THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE BREAST TO A STAGE] WHEN ONE'S HAND BEING PUT ON THE NIPPLE IT SINKS AND ONLY SLOWLY RISES AGAIN. GEMARA. SHE IS LIKE 'AN UNRIPE FIG'22 WHILE SHE IS YET A CHILD, as it is written in Scripture, The fig-tree putteth forth her green figs.23 'A FIG IN ITS EARLY RIPENING STAGE',24 WHEN SHE IS IN THE AGE OF HER MAIDENHOOD, as we have learnt: Figs [become subject to tithe] as soon as they reach an early stage of ripening25 and Rabbah b. Bar Hana explained this to mean: As soon as their tips grow white. And if you prefer I might say that the meaning26 is derived from the following: For my soul became impatient of them, and their soul also loathed27 me.28 A RIPE FIG',29 as one would say, 'It has come forth complete.'30 WHAT ARE THE MARKS [OF A BOGERETH]? R. JOSE THE GALILEAN SAYS: THE APPEARANCE OF THE WRINKLE. Samuel explained: Not the actual appearance of the wrinkle, but it suffices if, when putting her hands behind her, the wrinkle beneath the breast seems to appear. Samuel31 examined his slave and paid her four zuz compensation for the indignity. Samuel thereby followed his principle, for Samuel stated: Of them32 may ye make bondmen33 for ever,34 I have given them to you for work35 but not to be subjected to indignities. Samuel assigned his female slaves to individual husbands.36 R. Nahman interchanged them.37 R. Shesheth entrusted them to Arabs38 but told them 'Be careful to have no intercourse with an Israelite'. R. JOSE SAYS etc. What is the meaning of ukaz?39 — Samuel replied: The nipple of the breast. Our Rabbis taught: What are the marks of bagruth? R. Eleazar son of R. Zadok stated, When the breasts begin to shake.40 R. Johanan b. Beroka stated, When the top of the nose41 grows white. But is not a woman when this grows white already old? — Rather said R. Ashi, when the top of the nose splits.42 R. Jose stated, When a ring is formed around the nipple. R. Simeon stated, When the mons veneris grows lower. To Part b Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files Though terumah proper is exempt. Cf. prev. n. mut. mut. V. Glos. Lit., 'they thought' (cf. supra p. 324, n. 12). At the present time. Who exempts the dough under discussion from the dough-offering. At the present time. And that, consequently, terumah at the present time is also Pentateuchal. Of course not. A Rabbinical enactment could not override a Pentateuchal law. Consequently it must be admitted (as stated supra 46b ad fin.) that R. Jose holds terumah at the present time to be merely a Rabbinical institution. Of course it is possible. Hence the Baraitha cited provides no proof for the contention supra that the view that R. Jose holds terumah at the present time to be Rabbinical 'may be supported by a process of reasoning'. The Israelites in the days of Joshua. Years that may well be compared to the 'present time'. Ki thabo'u, so MS.M. Cur. edd., bebo'akem. Num. XV, 18, in the context of the dough-offering; Heb. beboa'kem, emphasis on kem 'your'. Of the obligation of the dough-offering. Since that time, therefore, there could be no Pentateuchal obligation; and the dough offering of the present time must consequently be a mere Rabbinical institution. Lit., 'these are the days of'. Childhood and maidenhood. The Sages. Lit., 'when it rises'. Lit., 'when they incline'. Paggah (v. foll. n.). Cant. II, 13, paggeha, the noun absolute being paggah (with the pron. suff. of the third sing. fem. and the omission of the dagesh in the pe owing to a preceding he) which proves that the term is applied to the earliest stage of growth. Bohal (v. foll. n.). Misheyibahalu, of the same root as bohal. Of bohal. Bahalah, of the same rt. as bohal. Zech. XI, 8; loathing is an early stage in the 'rising' of the food. [H] Zemel. Phonetic etymology. [H], yazetha mele'ah containing the letters of [H]. In his investigations on the applicability of R. Jose's ruling. Canaanitish slaves. Ta'abodu, lit., 'you may cause them to work'. Lev. XXV, 46. Cf. Prev. n. but one. Lit., 'he appointed for them', sc. he did not allow promiscuous intercourse among his slaves. To each female slave was assigned one particular male slave. Unlike Samuel he did not mind promiscuity among his slaves. Their morality, he held, was not his concern. Rendered supra 'nipple'. In walking. Aliter: 'to become stiff' (v. Jast.). The central circle of the oblate part of the breast (Jast.), Aliter (Jast.). When the skin of the central circle of the oblate part of the breast appears wrinkled. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference ### Niddah 47b So also did R. Simeon1 state: The Sages have indicated in [the physical development of] a woman three marks below and corresponding ones above. If, namely, she is like an unripe fig above, it may be taken for granted2 that she has not yet grown two hairs. If she is above like a fig in its early ripening, it may be taken for granted2 that she has already grown two hairs. If she is like a ripe fig above it may be taken for granted that the mons veneris has grown lower. What is meant by mons veneris? — R. Huna replied: There is a rounded eminence above that place,3 and as the girl grows in age it steadily grows lower. Rabbi was asked:4 In agreement with whose view is the halachah? He sent word in reply: In agreement with all so as to restrict5 the law.6 R. Papa and R. Hinena son of R. Ika differ. One taught it7 in connection with this,8 while the other taught it in connection with the law of the Tyrian courtyard. For we have learnt: Which courtyard9 imposes the obligations of tithe?10 R. Simeon11 ruled: A Tyrian courtyard in which objects are safely kept.12 (Why is this described as a Tyrian courtyard? — Rabbah b. Bar Hana citing R. Johanan replied: Since in Tyre they put a watchman at the door of a courtyard.) R. Akiba ruled: Any courtyard which one may open and another close13 is exempt from tithe.14 R. Nehemiah ruled: Any courtyard in which no one is ashamed to eat is subject to tithe.15 R. Jose ruled: Any courtyard into which people may enter and none is asked, 'What do you want?' is exempt.14 R. Judah ruled: If there were two courtyards, one within the other, the inner one is subject to tithe15 while the outer one is exempt.14 Rabbi was asked: In agreement with whose view is the halachah? He replied: The halachah is in agreement with all of them so as to restrict the law.16 MISHNAH. IF A WOMAN AT THE AGE OF TWENTY DID NOT PRODUCE TWO HAIRS,17 SHE MUST BRING EVIDENCE THAT SHE IS TWENTY YEARS OF AGE AND SHE BECOMES CONFIRMED AS A WOMAN WHO IS INCAPABLE OF PROCREATION AND NEITHER PERFORMS HALIZAH NOR IS TAKEN IN LEVIRATE MARRIAGE. IF A MAN OF THE AGE OF TWENTY YEARS DID NOT PRODUCE TWO HAIRS,17 THEY18 MUST BRING EVIDENCE THAT HE IS TWENTY YEARS OLD AND HE BECOMES CONFIRMED19 AS A SARIS20 AND NEITHER SUBMITS TO HALIZAH NOR PERFORMS THE LEVIRATE MARRIAGE; SO BETH HILLEL. BETH SHAMMAI RULED: WITH THE ONE AS WELL AS WITH THE OTHER [THIS TAKES PLACE AT] THE AGE OF EIGHTEEN. R. ELIEZER RULED IN THE CASE OF THE MALE, IN AGREEMENT WITH BETH HILLEL, WHILE IN THAT OF THE FEMALE, IN AGREEMENT WITH BETH SHAMMAI, SINCE A WOMAN MATURES EARLIER THAN A MAN. GEMARA. But I would point out an incongruity: The same law applies whether one is21 of the age of nine years and one day or whether one is of the age of twenty years but had not produced two hairs!22 — R. Samuel son of R. Isaac citing Rab replied: This law23 applies only where other symptoms of a saris24 also appeared on him. Raba observed: This25 may also be arrived at by a deduction. For it was stated, AND HE BECOMES CONFIRMED AS A SARIS.26 This is conclusive. Where, however, no other symptoms of a saris had developed, how long [is one27 regarded as a minor]? — R. Hiyya taught: Until he has passed middle age.28 Wherever people come with such a case29 before R. Hiyya,30 he used to tell them, if the youth was emaciated, 'Let him first be fattened'; and if he was stout, he used to tell them, 'Let him first be made to lose weight';31 for these symptoms32 appear33 sometimes as a result of emaciation and sometimes they appear as a result of stoutness. Rab stated: It is the law throughout this chapter that age is calculated from one point of time to another point of time;34 but 'Ulla stated: This is the case only where we have explicitly learnt it.35 According to 'Ulla all is well since there is a satisfactory reason why in one case it was stated36 'one day' while in the other this was not stated; but according to Rab, why was not this37 stated in all cases?38 Furthermore, it was taught: R. Jose b. Kipper stated in the name of R. Eliezer, If thirty days of the twentieth year have passed it is exactly the same as if the entire year had passed;39 and so also Rabbi at Lydda ruled, If thirty days of the eighteenth year have passed it is exactly the same as if the entire year had passed.40 Now one may well agree that there is no difficulty [as regards the contradiction between the ruling] of Rabbi and that of R. Jose b. Kipper, since the former41 is in agreement with Beth Shammai42 while the latter43 is in agreement with Beth Hillel;42 but does not this44 present a difficulty against Rab?45 — This46 is a question in dispute between Tannas.47 For it was taught: The year that is mentioned in connection with consecrated things;48 the year that is mentioned in connection with houses in walled cities;49 the two years50 in connection with a field of one's possession;51 the six years in connection with a Hebrew servant,52 and so also the years in the age of a son and a daughter53 are all to be calculated from one point of time to another point of time.54 Whence do we deduce the duration of the year that was mentioned in connection with consecrated things? R. Aha b. Jacob replied: Scripture said, A lamb of its55 year,56 which implies, Its own year and not a calendar year.57 Whence do we deduce the duration of the year that was mentioned in connection with the houses in walled cities? — Scripture said, Until the end of his year of sale58 which implies, Only his year of sale but not a calendar year.57 Whence do we deduce the duration of the two years in connection with a field of one's possession? — Scripture said, According unto the number of - To Next Folio - Original footnotes renumbered. See Structure of the Talmud Files Cur. edd. in parenthesis add 'b. Yohai'. Lit., 'it is known'. Euphemism. With reference to the various views given supra on the marks of bogruth. Sc. whichever of the marks appears the girl is regarded as a bogereth and her father has no longer the right to annul her vows. Aliter: Even if only the earliest of the marks has appeared she enters a doubtful state of bogruth and if her father received on her behalf a token of betrothal from one man and she received a similar token from another she must be properly divorced from both. She must be divorced from the latter in case she is already a bogereth when her father's act cannot annul hers; and she must be divorced from the former in case she is not a bogereth before all the tokens have appeared. MS.M., Alfasi and Asheri add, 'R. Johanan and Sabya say: the halachah is in agreement with all of them so as to restrict the law'. Rabbi's reply. The marks of a bogereth. So MS.M. and sep. edd. of the Mishnah. Cur. edd. read, 'Tyrian courtyard'. On produce that was brought into it (cf. Bezah 34b). Var. lec. Ishmael (v. separate edd. of the Mishnah). Ma'as. III, 5. Such may be treated for the purpose of tithes as a house and consequently it imposes the obligations of tithe on any produce that is brought into it. Sc. there is no one man responsible for both the opening and the closing. Sc. produce brought into it does not become subject to tithe, since such a courtyard cannot be regarded as a suitable place for the safe keeping of objects. V. p. 329, n. 11. I.e., if it is in any one of the conditions mentioned it subjects to tithe any produce brought into it. The marks of puberty. The relatives of the widow who desire her to be exempt from the duties of halizah and the levirate marriage. By a display of the prescribed symptoms. A eunuch. Lit., 'it is one (and the same) to me'. Yeb. 96b. So long as the pubic hairs have not appeared a person retains the status of a minor. How then is this to be reconciled with our Mishnah which assigns a new legal status at the age of eighteen or twenty? Of our Mishnah (cf. prev. n.). Described in Yeb. 80b. That before one is regarded a saris other symptoms, besides the absence of pubic hairs, must also have made their appearance. Which implies that other independent symptoms of a saris had already developed earlier. If two pubic hairs did not appear. Lit., 'most of his years'. Of one who attained the age of twenty without having grown two hairs. Var. lec. 'Raba' (cf. Yeb. 97a). Lit., 'cause him to be lean'. Described in Yeb. 80b. The reading in Yeb. 97a is 'disappear'. The age of twenty, for instance, is deemed to have been attained at the completion of full twenty years of life and not merely at the beginning of the twentieth calendar year. Lit., 'where we learnt we learnt' etc., sc. only where the years and the first day of the year following were specifically mentioned as, for instance, 'three years and one day' (supra 44b), 'eleven years and one day' (supra 45b). Where, however, (as in our Mishnah) the years only are given one day of the twentieth calendar year is regarded as the whole of that year and the person is deemed to be twenty years of age from that day. Lit., 'that is it that it was stated here'. 'And one day'. Lit., 'let him teach'. Lit., 'behold it is like the twentieth year in all its matters'. Cf. prev. n. Eighteen years. V. our Mishnah. Twenty years. The view accepted by both authorities cited that the part of a year is regarded as the whole of it. Who stated supra that the years must be complete. Whether the part of a year is regarded as the entire one. One of whom, as will be shown presently, holds the same view as Rab. Sc. that certain beasts for sacrifices must be one year old. Cf., If a man sell a dwelling house in a walled city, he may redeem it within a whole year (Lev. XXV, 29). This is deduced infra. Cf. Lev. XXV, 14ff. Cf., If thou buy a Hebrew servant, six years shall he serve (Ex. XXI, 2). Which (so it is now presumed) were discussed in our Mishnah. Cf. p. 331, n. 14 supra. E.V., 'the first'. Lev. XII, 6. Lit., 'the year of the number of the world'. Lev. XXV, 29, E.V., Within a whole year after it is sold. Tractate List / Glossary / / Bible Reference |  |  |